I shoot long range and have been for years. But it seems long range to me is not what it is to others. I read on here people being impressed with a 400 meter shot with a weapon they spent over a grand on. Sorry I've made 600 meter shots iron sights at SDM for the army easily with an off the rack M16A4 with ball ammo. Now you get the high power its too easy for a shot of 800 meters or further. Am I the only one who thinks the art/skill of actual long range shooting is dead???

I don't think long distance shooting is dead, it's just difficult for the average schmuck to do today because of the logistics involved. If you look at the shooting population as a whole, not many people have a place to shoot 500 yards or longer. How can you practice and become proficient when you can't even shoot? You can't. So hypothetically, the open field at farmer Joe's becomes that person's "long distance" shooting spot and it's only 325 yards. That 325 yards is that person's "long distance". Also, how many people on this forum have an opportunity to even shoot 325 yards? Not many. Not everyone lives rural and even if they do, don't have the acreage to shoot longer distances. I don't know how many posts I've read here where people comment on their local shooting range being the only place they can shoot and it's longest range is 50 or 75 yards, with most being 100. About the only thing a person can do there is sight in their rifle.

Until recently, 600 yards was the longest I could shoot and I had to drive 60 miles to do that (our hunting lease property down in NW Florida). Now, I've made arrangements with my neighbor here in 'Bama to shoot across his bermuda grass fields (2 hay pastures separated by a narrow fenceline). The open space there exceeds max. effective range of my .308. I haven't gone to do it yet because it's hunting season here and that runs through 31 January. After that, I can go air it out all I want.

I can't quantify "long distance" for everyone and I don't think there is a magic number to quantify it either. Each person has their own comfort zone and that zone is influenced by the training they've received in the past or how well they are well-read/studied and self taught.

You being able to shoot 600 meters with iron sights only tells me you completed basic training (and I thank you for your service by the way!). How many Maggie's drawers did you see in attaining that qualification?

On the other hand, I feel that someone who has never received formal training and shooting 600 meters, or yards for that matter, with AR-15 open sights is exemplary and with a rifle/scope combo...noteworthy.

Well i would have to agree that much more factors in than just distance. for example what target your shooting at, im assuming in the military your probably shooting at man sized targets, which obviously would be much easier than shooting at paper thats 2x2. also what gun your using, if your using an M4, i would say if your hitting paper at 400-600 yards then it is a pretty good long range shot, however if your using an M82 then thats a pansy shot, you better go out another 400-600yrds at least.

for example i often shoot at milk juggs with my pretty standard Sabre M4 (iron sights). i would consider 100 yards or less close range, 200 yards middle, 300-400 decently long, 500 long, and 600 or farther long long. however ive never actually shot past 300yrds. and another thing, i shoot standing up with no rest, this also effects how good the shot is, if you have a bench rest, then it will be a little easier.

bottomli​ne, many things factor in that can change the definition of long range shot.

Seems i hit a nerve and i didn't try to even. What I mean is it seems the focus is all on CQB even for competition anymore. And I am lucky i have within a few minutes of me an old power line clearing that is a little over 800 meters that we set out 12x12 plates to hit.

I didn't mean to insult anyone at all I was just curious for a good opinion.

Nah, no nerves struck :-) Just good debate and excellent discussion! It's a good post, glad you brought it up.

Well MEM you took the post right out of my fingers. Any shot is a long shot if it tests your abilities. Olympic air rifle only shoot at 10 meters but hit a target the size of a dime. You have to look at long vs. difficult shot.

To me the art of marksmanship has been lost both in the military and civilian world. And please take no offense to what I am about to say I am not bashing any branch of the military. The only branch of the service who still shoots a known distance course of fire out to 600 yards in basic training is the Marine Corps and now I believe they are allowed to shoot with optics on occasion once out of basic. The Army shoots a pop up course of fire out to 400, I think, the Navy shoots and indoor course on reduced targets, again I think, and the Air Force does not even carry weapons much less shoot them as it gets their hands dirty and messes up the manicure. Just kidding on that last one but I think they shoot a reduced range course also.

What I am trying to get at is that what was once a major accomplishment in life is not so great anymore. If you popped a deer with a 30/30 rifle at 300 yards and dropped it in its tracks with one shot you had done something. Now with the trusty .399 super magnum and 56x laser range finding, digital camera optic, latte dispensing shooting from a concrete mounted bipod hitting something at 1200 yards is not a chore.

I work with a great bunch of Army guys, gals, men, women where I am at. They know there jobs well but if they attach anymore s**t to an M4 I will scream. I know that it is not their idea but damn. The rifle was designed as a short, lightweight carbine and by the time you add all the crap you now have a 14 pound short carbine that doesnt shoot any better. The average soldier today if you took off the ACOG, laser, itty bitty CQB electronic sight mounted to the ACOG that are on their rifles many would be unable to hit a man sized target at medium distances. The young men that are issued the M-14 DMR here receive additional training but, guess what, from what I have seen it is a basic rifle marksmanship class related to long range shooting with the M-14 I know there is more involved with it than that but it is the mainstay of the course. To give an idea on the CQB craze the shooting society tends to follow trends of Law Enforcement and the military. If they got it we want it. Recent history has flooded us with images of kicking doors, full auto weapons fired a three feet so we follow suit. I dont have to know how to shoot far or good I will wait til he gets close.

We as shooters have become dependant on toys, gadgets and the latest craze. We need to get back to basics. You want to impress me take and iron sighted .22 and shoot a bottle cap at 50 yards offhand several times in a row. Once you can do that you can shoot with optics and lasers.

Anyway enough on my soapbox. There is something called Project Appleseed which is bringing back the skills or marksmanship to the general public. Take a look at it. And to Infantry Grunt you have ruffled no feathers here son keep up your shooting, show others how to do it and most of all keep asking the who, what, when, wheres and why's of life you will be amazed at what you learn

TacMan,

You and I will get along fine here. I've been preaching iron sights for the last two years on this site. Sure I have rifles with scopes and I have AR's with scopes/optics, but as I have said many, many times here (and have almost been virtually pistol-whipped for saying so much) my go-to AR is a plain-jane AR-15 A2 model with absolutely no bells and whistles. I don't know if I could hit a bottle cap at 50 yards offhand or not, but I will damned sure tell you that mr. badguy doesn't want me shooting at him with it inside max-effective range!

You keep preaching iron sights...I got your back!